Hi all

You will utterly fail.

Yay, we now get prophetic announcements!

Seriously guys, this bickering can stop now, methinks? I mean, we’ve all spewed a lot of crap and we can see nobody will change his or her mind. At this point it becomes an evolutionist VS creationist kind of debate: it’s stalled and likely won’t go anywhere but down.

If you want to continue the fight, feel free to do so through PMs. I’m not locking this (because OP apparently doesn’t like that), but please please please stop it people. It’s getting stale now.

@Huor:

@Dark Angel:

@Predator:
You in particular you as person cant demand OP to delete stuff that is not yours. You are an admin - well. But you are not the owner of that Stuff. AFAIK it is Fir. So he has to have the balls to request this. Not you. Anyway any PM was not posted on a public forum. Its just legally if OP asks his staff for opinions - isn’t it?

I see that WTS feels attacked when a single and well known or even the admin person is accused. Same applies to SWAT but I feel very much that this here (joke) is just an exception from it. We were discredit by this joke and you all seems to don’t see it…headshaking

first off all i didn’t demand him,i have ask it polite on him,

and nobody send me F!R can talk by him self(he is a human) and he is a man, so i think he have balls ;D

what you say now that i as serverhost have nothing to say ,about removing the stuff from a forum
that it is not my stuff but that F!R is the owner?
we from WTS are a litle bit differend ,we have a very good and strong team.
and when F!R -Wicked Witch or me do a request for deleting our stuff,then we have talked about it
so i as server owner have also something to say
we react as a team
i do all the pr stuff for the WTS and i have aranged the advertising on the swat forum.
so it is very strange that it is not alowed for me to ask for deleting
the swat team know’s me very well
and when swat don’t delete our stuff,it is his own decission.
then he let it there,and must be happy with it;)

btw we don’t feel us attacked,we only give our opinion

and for FriendlyFire
for me the Swat part is closed

So the fact seems to vanish:
Here we go with the answer of SWAT to Predator, when he request him to remove the WTS stuff:

As i already wrote in my PM reply I will not waste my time with the removal of anything.
I fail to see why I actually should do that. In the past months I was often enough target of FIRs attacks in close to all FL communities (and obviously he belongs to your team). Attacks which often were very personal and offensive. And now I get such a request without even being told about serious reasons (if those exist).

In the past years I have recommented WTS to many players… I did this on TLR and on many other FL sites… I did ads for WTS… and all of a sudden I receive such a treatment from you WTS guys?
Maybe such a behaviour is normal in the new freelancer community meanwhile… ?

SWAT_OP-R8R

That not a “Sorry Pred, you need F!R to confirm that”,
that’s aggressive and obviously SWAT feels insulted by that request.

So how do we have to see his own public request here, to remove all SWAT stuff,
if we see his own reaction he now tries to camouflage?

For me it was a clear hostile action against TSP
and in the same second SWAT announces his upcoming mod @ the all evil TLR,
everyone needs to fight after his statements, while still he keeps popping up here
to tell stories about ‘community’.

WOW!

Oh yes and evil me - i v been bad and insulting poor innocent SWAT
by pointing at facts and showing the awful truth.

I think this thread is a good example as to why I think the Freelancer community is a giant pile of trash. I love you all.

@Sion:

I think this thread is a good example as to why I think the Freelancer community is a giant pile of trash. I love you all.

I think if something is as dangerous as flame wars, its the constant badmouthing of the so called Freelancer community.
There are some very bright lights in this community and if its all that bad, why are there still as many people playing this game as back in ~2006?

@w0dk4:

There are some very bright lights in this community and if its all that bad, why are there still as many people playing this game as back in ~2006?

Because the game is good, and there is typically a pretty decent sense of community around most individual servers - it’s only the greater Freelancer community as a whole - specifically the interactions between the large ‘community’ oriented sites - that are unpleasent to look upon.

fact is - yes i didnt remove that stuff by request
in the past 7 years that SWAT does exist not a single post that didnt violate the forum rules has been removed by the staff - it is a forum policy not to delete something… not to lock something… not to forbid something that is not against the rules.

Every member has the right and ability to edit and remove own posts… own threads… even the own accounts. But I explained that already a few posts before. You want your posts removed… then do it… the staff will not interfere.

also fact is - that I went to TLR doing some posts there
fact is also that I said here on TSP that this has good reasons
the one and only legit reason to get the bad elements removed from the administration and being replaced with the original site owner (bakedpotatoe)
The mentioned thread about my mod were done by request (if you would have read that thread you would know that). And if you would have read that TLR forum you would know that I was not holding azzas hand in order to get his next best friend.
The current situation at TLR and the creation of Reactorforge wouldnt have happened if I wouldnt have done what I have done.

That much about my motives to go there. At least that step was moraly more right than those discussions about destroying TLR that were done on the TSP admin board not that long ago. At least my efforts did lead to some changes eventhough they were not enough to finish the initial task. After the past few days I regret that I even tried it.

For everybody, we here in Holland have a nice dumb song…But it always brings a smile to people when they hear the song

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aCAekegA4Yg

Hope it makes you all happy, even you don’t understand it, because it isn’t english. But it sounds so very happy.
When you need a translation…just ask

Happy weekend from all of us from WTS

" when you wrestle with a pig, pretty soon those watching can’t who the pig is - everyone is so thoroughly covered with mud" -
unknown

I can see y’alls lips movin, but i can’t hear what you’re saying for the music in my head……

HI JAMMI… ( did Jammi hear me? )
HI JAMMI
( I stiil don’t know if Jammi heard me )
and I sooo liked the idea …… starlancer… that would be pretty cool

@OPR8R:

in that case the music here at TSP sounds terrible

So why do you feel the need to keep posting here ?

You certainly seem to have a high opinion of yourself. Aren’t you a bit self-obsessed to feel the need to keep bragging about your alleged great achievements and write pages of self-praise ?

As far as the average FL player like me can see, you are not any more important than any of the active contributors to this community and I don’t see any of them speak half as much about themselves and “their community” as you do.

If you feel unfairly targeted, a bit of humility and tact may be a good start to help your cause.

I repeat it again (as i have said it 2 times before)
It was requested by one of the previous posters that I show what I have done in the FL community and has nothing to do with self-praise. And I am posting here because some people here think they have the right to discredit me, my work and my community on this and other thread. If this wouldnt have happened in first place I wouldnt have been in the need to defend my community and its members here.

Not even an appoligy to me and what is even more important to me members has been done. This topic wouldnt even have been run out of control if people wouldnt have verbally attacked my community and this topic would be long gone if those people would have appologized.

@Huor:

@Dark Angel:
Don’t switch the statements. You know what you have posted and it was clear whom you meant. If not i guess you does not meant the TSP Hence i thank you for naming me moron - i really appreciate it

I actually think both sides of the arguments are fanboys and morons, not everyone but some. So I’d reserve your assumptions.

As we all can see:
The facts are twisting over and over again.
Now it’s forum policy, not to remove the topic as request by Predator.

A not to be discussed law of ‘God OP-R8R’ (as to read in the SWAT forum):

That topic there will also enlight, why SWAT and friends show here:
To have a little flamewar


and to
@OPR8R:

… show what I have done in the FL community …

what for sure
@OPR8R:

… . has nothing to do with self-praise. …

even if
@OPR8R:

I repeat it again (as i have said it 2 times before) …

Some of us are obviously so silly,
that God OP-R8R has to tell us 3 times,
who he is.

And obviously that’s what’s community for him:
All have to praise OP-R8R and
@F!R:

……anything not promoting this persons opinion,
will just lead to more crying and bitching.

TY + have a nice live.

you forget to say that these posts were made after people here started to attack me and my work… you blame us if we defend ourself from initial attacks that got done here?

you cant let it go to attack and discredit another community… that is what is happening here
it went even so far that Septimus which meanwhile joined SWAT received personal attacks and threats via mail containing that some people here want to destroy SWAT
how sick are you that you have to act in such a way?
because of what?
because I said “no” to some ideas… go to the threads and have a look how many people voiced ecactly the same oppinion about those ideas… do they get blamed? no… if they say something then it is ok.

you blame me for going to TLR. look around how many of those people here went to TLR to get their mods announced… underverse, monkey universe, discovery and many others but the only community getting blamed for it is SWAT

you blame us for what we wrote on our forum… but you dont say that this was just in reply to what has been written about us before on THIS forum here
obviously when you start to flame about others … even insult others then it is ok but if those others defend each other then it is an evil act that we initiated because what you have done before to provoke that we have to defend us is suddenly not important anymore

Maybe I just should post some logs on my forum to show what is happening here. Maybe I should post some screenshots from the TSP admin boards… some communities our there would surely will be interested and for sure surprised about what has been discussed about them.

and about the self praising
as long I was member of TSP the oppinions about the achievements that have been done for the FL community it has been used by TSP in various threads and news… “WE THE IMFAMOUS FREELANCER COMMUNITY have achieved THIS AND THAT… WE HAVE MANAGED TO GET MANY FL COMMUNITES ADDED TO THE MS FANSITE… WE HAVE MANAGED TO BUILD MODS THAT GOT INTO THE TOP100 OF MOTY AWARDS… WE HAVE DONE SO MUCH OTHER STUFF… WE ARE THE HEROS”
actually that stuff has been done by others… and now is called “self praising”

Fir m8,

i am a bit longer here than all the troubles started. So i am not only here cause i will defend SWAT and the community i am belonging to. In first instance i am here to read news about FL and its modding community. So am i blamed for this now? You are pleased to explain why friends of SWAT are here. Cause you seem to know better than me why i am here…

OP is right about what you have pictured here. The “bad” posts at SWAT were made after OP was discredit here again as he wrote about the criticism about his minds whats going wrong here. Well what you posted there on screenshots are just jokes m8. Ahm wait - jokes - i got a deja vu If you would post some screens from the first post of this thread you would also show that SWAT would see a lost if TSP would have went down and were lost in the community. Nothing at all - screenshots are only a momentum you wont even recognize in what content they were posted. So don’t have something valuable to add. Yep truly there was posted something “funny” about having flames here. But thats not your business and it was not related to WTS.

Anyway Fir. Your issues with SWAT have nothing to do with TSP. So I please you to come to SWAT with your concerns. Anyhow we need to stop bitching each other here where nothing of this is TSP related - at least not between you and OP.

@OP: Err, I’m sorry but that’s going a tad too far. Yes, we are proud of what the community is doing. That doesn’t mean we’re taking ownership on it. You’re twisting the words of everyone involved here. If you want to have a one-sided argument where you’re making up stuff, feel free to go elsewhere. I’ve been discussing with Huor through PMs and liked where it was going, but you show a complete lack of manners here that makes me fear this was all a waste.

We’ve never said we got other sites added on the fansite apart from ours. We know you added the others and we thanked you for it already (see this thread for the whole story, and remember “we” means EVERYONE INVOLVED: you, me, that little guy in the corner that joined FL yesterday, we as the global FL community). Yes, we did achieve a few things. Do we have to hide that fact or can’t we simply rejoice about what contributions we’ve done? The FLCN works, so what? We can be happy about it, no need to get jealous or hide the fact. The self-praising you’re describing is incredibly skewed from reality.

As for the email, I’d really like to see it, and so would the other server admins. That kind of attitude is intolerable, no matter the level of disagreement we have. If you can forward us the original sender and the contents of the message, we will make sure whoever sent it loses any access to the server admins and owners boards as we do not condone such actions.

Oh and OP, the server admins boards are private for a reason. They’re used so other admins can speak out their opinion freely without having to soften it or veil it, no matter how wrong it may seem to the outsider. Showing those would just fuel hatred for no reason.

Concentrate on the work, and even: what you can do for others.

Otherwise, may beeps bite you.

I hate doing this so here it goes. This needs to stop now, this thread has turned into who has the best community, who’s been in the FL community the longest, and I have done this for the community, etc, etc. I see one little jib turn into 5 pages of spam. Does it ever stop?? I can go to at least 3 different sites and see the same stuff over and over again. I even get propositioned by the Swat Community to join them (Jan 2008). Now I know why I like to be quiet because of all the negative stuff that goes on in the Freelancer Community in general. More than likely anything I try to post on my mod will get overrun by fanboys and their ilk (Come to this sever we have the best community, we have the best mod, we won this award, we have been nominated this many years in a row, etc. Come on, just because a mod is nominated doesn’t mean it is the best) and the original topic be forgotten (Like this one).  Come on guys, are we trying to kill FL or make it live?? More than likely, I’ll catch flak from this, but I can care less. I am about to strike out on my own if stuff like this keeps on going on.

I’m a half crazy 50 years old system maker, not a pro at all. But I can do some nice stuff, check at

http://www.uberlancer.com/index.php/topic,645.msg7506.html#new (Uberlancer / Space my trace).

In case anyone is doing something meaningful, I just might be available. Personal e-mail [email protected].

Remember: I love the game, not you.

@Nightstalker:

I hate doing this so here it goes. This needs to stop now, this thread has turned into who has the best community, who’s been in the FL community the longest, and I have done this for the community, etc, etc. I see one little jib turn into 5 pages of spam. Does it ever stop?? I can go to at least 3 different sites and see the same stuff over and over again. I even get propositioned by the Swat Community to join them (Jan 2008). Now I know why I like to be quiet because of all the negative stuff that goes on in the Freelancer Community in general. More than likely anything I try to post on my mod will get overrun by fanboys and their ilk (Come to this sever we have the best community, we have the best mod, we won this award, we have been nominated this many years in a row, etc. Come on, just because a mod is nominated doesn’t mean it is the best) and the original topic be forgotten (Like this one).  Come on guys, are we trying to kill FL or make it live?? More than likely, I’ll catch flak from this, but I can care less. I am about to strike out on my own if stuff like this keeps on going on.

You’re just about right. And persons who have been associated longer with Freelancer, have said the same: There’s unnecessary competition within the Freelancer community. My personal view is, I would want to participate in the best mod ever - I’m a member in Uberlancer - but can that be made?

I wish it could, I’m even sure it could… but the narrowmindness of men seem to obstruct.

I welcome you and all others willing to participate in a common cause. Personal e-mail [email protected].